Ja289

spud, i think is trying to make an allegory or metaphor between the two, i dont think he means it in a literal sense

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Spudchucker

thank you

im saying the way christianity is set up, its almost as if it is an underground communist society, run purely by the love for god some people have. its sort of the idea of "we love big brother"

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Spudchucker

capitalism is definitely way better as far as government is concerned

to those of you who still dont undersand what im talking about- have you read/seen dinotopia? dinotopia is a perfect communist utopian society. they dont have a gonvernment to keep themselves communist, because they dont need one. the people willingly do what is needed. if you think a government is supposed to enforec a communist society, then you don know what communism is.

not one government out today is communism in the sense that it is supposed to be. karl marx would cry if he saw what "communism" looks like today

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martix_agent

well that's an interesting relationship you've discovered, never thought of it waht way. but I dont' think it's quite the same. I though thsi was gonna be about how intheroty communism would work, and that is very true. but humans are greedy so it's never actually work...but it's a wonderful idea on paper

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HP_lovecraft

The fatal flaw in all communism is that it is based on the philisophical notion that humans are inherently evil, and desires for succes only drive that evil, so it needs to be suppressed at all costs. This the idea for a class-less, sucess-less society.
But the contradiction is that it humans people in charge, into a vast vaccum, giving them emmense power.

So, instead of a "country of equal farmers", you have an totalitariam oligarchy of a country of farmers, rules by a corrupt few.

This is why communism ALWAYS degerates into a totalitariam oligarchy. Its a flaw in the system. This was explained by PLATO about 2,100 years ago. His book "Platos Republic" documents how communism would create the perfect society, but then explain how it would be impossible, and ALWAYS degenerate.

Now, the church is not communist, since communism BY DESIGN does not allow religion IN ANY FORM. So, it is a fundemental concept.
But, if you ignore that, the church is STILL not communist, since the church has structure (ie popes, cardinals, bishops, priests, decons, etc). Communism is NOT SUPPOSED to have structure. Everyone is equal... even though thats not what really happens.

But if we ignore that also... and have a church run society? Well, that would be a facist government, not communism. PRETTY BIG DIFFERENCE, even though both are totalitarian.
A great example of this is IRAN. Its run by the church, and facist.
Its also a great example of why a church should NOT run governemnt.

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onesikpup

im just waiting for the fall of democracy....that also is inevitable. i dont think it matters what style of government you choose, inevitably the people will bring it to ruin. power corrupts.

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Spudchucker

read my first few posts and youll see that i state that i am talking about the protestan side of things, not catholic. i know a few things about catholisism, but im not gonna pretend to be some sort of expert. it is protestantism (that a word?) that i am saying looks a lot like an ideal communist society. from what i kow, i actually dont think the catholic structure looks much like a communist society

i totally agree with you on how it is always degenerative in government because of those few in power getting greedy.

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Gabriot

Hey spud, look into the Mennonite colleges, no tuition to get in, everything is done by christians, etc. I bet you'd find it interesting.

(And no I don't go to one)

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MrMacDude

I don't think its gonna be the fall of democracy. Rather, it will be the fall of the Western World. Civilizations rise and fall, not types of government. Similar concept, but I just thought I'd throw that in there.

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MeatIs4Beating

Im sorry, but i would/will/do put myself first, and i would want to train/practice for the profession i want, and then do that. If i was qualified as a doctor, and was made to be a janitor, someones ass is being capped.

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D_Smalls

anyone know anything about the small communities that all pool together? My english teacher stayed in one a while back while he was in the middle east.

Kabutz or something like that? Basically it was a small community that worked together and everyone did their part. And when they needed a new doctor, the best suited would be sent to take the schooling and return. Their education was paid for by the peopel of the community. because he would ultimately come back and repay them by helping them..

basically it all worked in this way.. it was pretty cool. But the problem was.. these kids were going off for schooling, experiencing private pocession and it corrupted them and they didnt want to return to sharing everything.

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128shot

Ok...

while that is awesome in every way, lets define corruption...

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When I was a kid, I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized that the Lord, in his wisdom, doesn't work that way. So I just stole one and asked him to forgive me.

Ja289

yeah im pretty sure those were these jewish settlements in israel a really long time ago. but yeah, i have heard of that before its pretty interesting.

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tippmannbeast

very interesting thread

Communism by Principal would theoretically create the perfect society. But that is not the way it happened in China or Russia. In China the Red Guards took the extremist route and were used as weapons of fear to push down western ideas and customs; communism could work if people were brought into it before they learned to be dependent on materialistic values. I believe that if people were to 'donate' their babies to a communist society and they accepted the ideals of communist law it would work. People would be unselfish, generous, conscientous, and equal; which is exactly why it can't work. People by nature aren't equal or unselfish.

With some tweaking, a communist-based society could possibly function but i'm not sure how long it would last.

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MrMacDude

Thats a funny typo

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sumsimpleracer

alright COMMUNISM only looks good on paper, it would be a great success if the followers were not rich and leaders would be uncorrupted and actually looked at facts to assign jobs to different people

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Number One Andrew

Do you even know what you're talking about.

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MrMacDude

QFT.

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ComradeMolyneux

qft. read a book

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