[Crypsis]

First off, I am a total noob and this is my first post here.

I have played paintball a handful of times and have really enjoyed it. I vastly prefer woodsball and scenario. I am pretty decent when I play, but find the rental guns and blurry masks are holding me back. I miss a ton of kills I know I could have gotten with a better gun. So I have decided its time to get a gun and mask of my own.

From these and other forums, I have seen alot of people advise to get a Spyder Imagine or a Tippman 98C with a J&J Ceramic barrel and a 12V Revolution hopper as an entry level setup. So far this advice seems sound and within the price range I want to work with when starting out. I can definitely afford more, but I want to work my way up slowly. I don't want to be an ultra decked out noob.

Personally, I don't like the weight and bulk of the Tippman that I use when I rent so I was thinking of the Spyder Imagine. Well, today I went to the local PB shop to shoot the sh*t with someone in person and get their opinion first hand about equipment. Their stock didn't include Spyders. They said there were too many problems with them and parts were hard to come by since they are built in Taiwan. They stock the equivalent Pirahanas made in Illinois, and advised me to look into those since they are easier to work with and get parts for, etc. Also, he said the J&J Ceramic would break easy and to get a Freak mini kit(with 4 inserts) so I could get a way better barrel and have alot more options of bore to use to match my paint at the fields.

So now, I am confused about what to start with. Some questions I have now are:

1) Are Pirahna's any good? I never see anyone talk about them.
2) Should I just get an Imagine from somewhere else anyway?
3) Is the Freak kit a good kit and worth the money?
4) Can you use guns with electric triggers in wet conditions like rain or wet foliage that has recently been rained on? I would hate to have an expensive piece of equipment short out if it isn't waterproof and cost me alot of money.

Thanks in advance for any help you might be able to give.

PS. All I want from a gun is accuracy. Maybe a little speed or short trigger pull, but dangit, I want accuracy!

[lbreevesii]

1. piranna's are pretty decent. but franctly what the dude is sayin about spyders is a load of total BS. what the deal most likley is that they have a deal buyin piranna's so he wants you to buy one of those over a spyder, which they don't have. funny thing is that spyders and piranna's work EXACTLY the same, same way as a mongoose, icon, or any other stacked tube blowback.
2. for woodsball the tippy is really king, its possible that the tippy you've rented is a pro/carbine or pro/am, those are heavier than the 98c, the 98c is about the same weight as the spyder. take your pick between guns, both will be good for you. take the spyder if you intend to possibly get into speedball down the road. the tippmann is much more rugged in the woods and what not is one of the reasons why it is the king of the woods.
3. the freak kit is one of the top kits on the market, i would not however shell out the money for a freak to put on a spyder. having a gun that barley costs more than your barrel kit is just odd. buy a J&J ceramic and stick with it. find a paint that matches it well and stick with it. Marballizers, Inferno, and Proball all fit the J&J ceramic very well.
4. you probably won't have a problem using an imagine in wet conditions as long as you aren't just letting it get soaked or anything, just be careful with it. that is another reason why i recommend the tippmann. tippmann's are the ak-47's of the paintball world, you can dunk em in water, fill em with crud, whatever and it'll still shoot, once again, this is why the tippmann tends to be preferred in the woods.

hope this helps
~Larry

btw, accuracy is primarily a matter of matching the paint to the barrel bore size. other factors do come into play, a well matched J&J can easily perform with more expensive barrels like the AA and comperable barrels.

[spydershutter68]

If u want to start your way up slowly then start out with a semi gun. Like the shutter. Thats is what i have, and after a while u can upgrade it to be like a angel (Exzaderating a little) but anyway u can do almost anything to it and nothing happends except maybe some cosmetic scaps and scraths. If u ever decide to change your mind and play speed bal then all u have to do is get a new trigger. And to make the gun really good all u have to do is.

: Get a new trigger (optional)
: Get a new barrel
: Get a new bolt
: Get a new expanison chamber (Or get hpa your choice).

[Crypsis]

Thanks for the reply guys. This gives me a lot to chew on. I appreciate the good advice.

[txaggie08]

not gonna interject any technical advice, but i will give you some phylisophical advice. Get what you want and fits how YOU play. dont run with the stream because the stream is flowing. spend the money you have on what fits you. once you get it were you think it should be, become a good player with it. that being said, i will trow some technical advice. Tippman 98's are not realy made for speedball. It CAN be done, but not comfortably(especialy from small bunkers). if you play speedball, or are considering it, you may wanna look at a little tighter marker than that. thats my opinion btw so dont take it as gospel, your gonna have to decide if thats for you or not.

[massballer2k5]

I agree ^.. Usually, when someone in the paintball world has a special company/marker they like, they stick with it an worship it. By asking for advice your gonna get alot of different input and marker bias.. Usually theres the Spyder supporters, and the Tippmann supporters. It all boils down to YOUR preference.. if you need any more help you can catch me on aim paintball62754

[Alpha]

Most paintball guns are made in America. If they're not, then they are shipped to and warehoused in America. There is no problems with spyders, nor is there a problem with keeping them in stock. Kingman can send you as many spyders as your store needs.

PIranhas are better then spyders, in my opinion, and from experience.

[skapunkin]

The man you talked to at the shop is quite a bit off.

If you are a woodsball guy, the 98C is perfect, and the A5 is about 2 steps up from a stock 98C. It has a nice feeding system but the consensus is that it guzzles air. Tippmanns are tough - ands thats not nonsense or bias. They just don't break (for the most part).

As far as that goes - a spyder can be used for woods too. Tippmann has the reputation for reliability, but spyders are reliable too. If you take decent care of the marker I cannot see any problem with using a spyder for woodsball. A spyder will outfire a 98C stock for stock - and I believe the A5 will match the spyder ball per second or at least come pretty close.

[PaintBallBob]

Originally Posted by Crypsis

Their stock didn't include Spyders. They said there were too many problems with them and parts were hard to come by since they are built in Taiwan. They stock the equivalent Pirahanas made in Illinois, and advised me to look into those since they are easier to work with and get parts for, etc. Also, he said the J&J Ceramic would break easy and to get a Freak mini kit(with 4 inserts)

Spyder imagines are one of the most poplar guns. Parts are just as easy to come by as with piranhas.
I owned a J&J Ceramic and it is very durable, didnt get a single scratch on it. Freaks on the other hand(non-SS ones anyway) have a reputation for being extremly fragile. Since your going to get a new marker eventually save some money and just get the J&J Ceramic...its $65 less and you wont be stuck with a $100 barrel kit once you get a new gun(i know you can buy new back pieces for the freak but why spend the extra money).

Originally Posted by Crypsis

1) Are Pirahna's any good? I never see anyone talk about them.

They are more reliable and easier to mantain then spyders but are heavier. I like them better then spyders.

Originally Posted by Crypsis

2) Should I just get an Imagine from somewhere else anyway?

Its up to you. What do you want from a gun? whats your budget? if you have enough get a Dragun TES($160). if not decide between the fishy(piranha) and the spyder

Originally Posted by Crypsis

3) Is the Freak kit a good kit and worth the money?

If your going to get a 4-piece kit, get the J&J Edge. same price, same amount of bores, more durable, less hassle. However, id suggest just going with a cheap barrel(Smart Parts Progressive, J&J Ceramic)

Originally Posted by Crypsis

4) Can you use guns with electric triggers in wet conditions like rain or wet foliage that has recently been rained on? I would hate to have an expensive piece of equipment short out if it isn't waterproof and cost me alot of money.

damp conditions are okay i believe. However, with rain you would have a problem anyway since the paint would be wet.

Originally Posted by Crypsis

PS. All I want from a gun is accuracy. Maybe a little speed or short trigger pull, but dangit, I want accuracy!

Accuracy is determined by the paint size to bore size match and the length of the barrel(15" is the most accurate length). In speed i hope your reffering to the ROF since the velocity of the marker is standard and doesnt change from one to another. In ROF, most e-markers will be the same(give or take one bps) and be able to go faster then youll be able to shoot accuratly(since low end blowback markers have a lot of kick).

[Alpha]

15" is not the most accurate length. One could argue that the ball stops accelerating past 8 inches. A few more inches adds for more porting, which makes the barrel wuieter.

[txaggie08]

should have said this originaly, try playing with both first. nothing gets you the feel of a marker like actualy using it. I would never buy a marker i had not at least seen and gotten to ripp a few shots off on one like it before i forked out the cash on it. especialy not something that costs more than 50$(when it gets that low its a mute point......).

[Crypsis]

Wow, some more good information. Great reply guys. This helps me get a better feel of the situation for sure.

PaintballBob, thanks for breaking it down like that and yes I did mean ROF.

txaggie08, good advice I will have to ask if they have demo guns to test fire.