[Angered Fists]

A big question among many new players is in regards to getting a tournament level marker. This can be a very daunting decision which I will be facing in the future, and I figure, the earlier I decide, the sooner I can start budgeting to afford what I plan on purchasing. Hopefully other new players will also benefit from this thread in their search for their next marker. This is not another which gun should I get thread, it will hopefully turn into a vastly more comprehensive compilation of information to help inform the uninformed to make the best decision for their situation.

I, like many others, got a Spyder for my first marker. I had played with rental Piranhas and earlier Brass Eagles for a number of years before deciding that I wanted the edge that comes with owning and maintaing/upgrading your own marker to match your playing style. I picked up my Xtra, earlier this summer, and played more times in this one summer than I had played in the past 7 summers combined. Now that the summer is over and the colder weather is starting (in Canada), my CO2 isn't performing as well as I would like it to, so the season is quickly coming to a close. As I look towards the coming winter, I see an opportunity to prepare myself for next summer and what I hope will be my initiation into playing competetive tournament paintball. Clearly I need a new hopper, a new air source, (hpa) and a new marker, hopefully with ups.

Earlier this summer, I was already decided that I would need a higher end marker in order to compete at the level that I wanted to compete... the highest level available, its in my nature to want to be the best. I first became interested in autocockers because everyone always talks about how accurate they are, and I value accuracy over speed, so it seemed like the natural choice. Further research has shown me that they are not necessarily more accurate, it is merely a myth that has been propogated. True, they are quality markers, but perhaps not quite worth my hard earned dollars, though I will most likely pick one up eventually, because I plan on being a gun horder.

As I continued to play more and more speedball at my local field, I came across a wider variety of markers than I was accustomed to from my days playing in the woods. I saw Timmy's, DM4's, Angels, Impy's, Omen's. The thing that striked me was that these guns were so much faster than anything I had seen before, and they were more effective in game than I had thought they would be. I had always thought that you didn't need to shoot 15 bps in order to be effective, but in certain situations, that is exactly what is called for. These markers, on top of being fast, were also just as accurate as any autocockers I had come across, so a new problems arises, therein lies my question.

I do not want to own the most expensive gun on the field. I don't want the prestige of owning a 1 of 1 custom milled, custom paint job, kissed by Bob Long himself marker, I just want a gun that will allow me to shoot ropes as accurately as possible. So my question is. Will a properly upgraded mid-range gun, be able to compete with a high end gun? Is it worth the time and money to purchase an impulse or bko and upgrade them, or will they never be on the same level as the higher end guns. I have been thinking about buying an impulse or a bko, and then upgrading them to enhance their performance, but I do not want to end up getting a new gun the summer after because the performance isn't what I had anticipated, but I don't want to buy a thousand dollar gun, only to find that I still need to upgrade it, and that I'm not that far ahead of those impulse owners. If I won the lottery, of course I'd be getting a matrix and a timmy, but at this point I just want the most bang for my buck.


tl:dr: Can mid-level markers compete with high end markers if properly upgraded, and will the necessary upgrades make the net cost greater than the high end markers to begin with?

[Master of Paint]

To answer the first tl;dr ?, yes if you put enough money and time into it

To the second question, yeah it will most likely end up costing more to upgrade a mid level marker to a high end marker than it is to just buy the high end one. And even then the high end one would perform better.

[Shutter_Guy]

It depends on what marker we are talking about. Impys can, bushies probably can (almost), cockers can (after all an upgraded mid range cocker essentially becomes a high end cocker with enough upgrading). Make sure you shoot some of the guns at the field and then make your choice. I've shot most high end gun styles, and they each have their own special feel. Matrixes/dm4's feel smooth with little kick, timmies are nice and light, angels are kinda in between (the newer ones at least) and cockers are just pleasant to shoot. I wouldn't rule out a nice e-cocker. I swear by mine and wouldn't trade it for any other gun.

[TheConMan41]

I don't know if the higher end guns will always perform better then the mid-ends. I've shot Timmy's that weren't nearly as consistent as my Impy.

Yay! Post 700!

[Shadymxcn]

here is a good story for you
My teams first tourny I was shooting my high-end Karnivor but the rest of my team had Tippman 98 and A-5's. In our very first tourny, and it was the first time that all 5 of us actually played together, we placed 9th out of 15 and where 15 points away from the semi-finals. Everyone there had timmies, dm4's and shockers. Even though we couldnt make lanes like them... we still did really good considering the teams we went against. The coolest thing about the whole tourny was that even though we played like trash the first half, the last 6 games we won and we beat 3 out of the top 4 teams there in the end. So its not the gun thats gets you the win. If you have skill guns are irrelavent. He may be able to shoot 20bps, but it only takes one shot to get him out.

Sorry if i didnt really answer your question though.

[Pr0ph3t]

Well bro, think of it this way:

Do you want a gun that only costs you $400 to begin with but by the time you get it on par with the highend markers you've dropped $1300 into it, and could have gotten that Dm4/Timmy/Whatever? Because not only is your resale gonna be pretty bad, you're gonna have a gun that imo still won't be AS good as the guns you're going against.

So sit back and ask yourself: Spend more money now and get the better performing gun, or, spend less money NOW but more on down the road for a gun that most likely will never ever perform as well as a high-end marker.

Your choice.

[braka]

Angered I went the latter route unconsciously... I would say go for a used higher end marker, think of it like buying a car.

You can buy a WRX Sti and trick it until it has 400+ hp and is very fast.
You can buy a Twin-Turbo porshe that will have 400+ hp stock and very fast.

The tricked out mid-range will be at the top of it's potential when it equals the stock high-end. The high-end has sick performance and potential to be upgraded after you buy it. Granted you might not need a sophisticated $350 ramping chip right away but the option to buy one is a nice feature.

[LuckXIII]

Well good consis can be fine tuned on a gun thru upgrades/regs/ etc which helps in overall accuracy, sure some guns offer better consis then others but only by fine margins (most of the time). What I'm trying to say under accuacy is that at what point is the desire for a perfect constant good shot too far? Theres multi bore barrel kits now, fine tuned hpa tanks, regulators, valves or what not. Sure getting a high end marker with a godly consis setup is great/must and all if your playing dynasty, legion, dogs whatever but the likeliness is that the highest you will go is Am (which to me at lease) a impy, cheap cocker, b2k or even a bko can easily fullfill your tourny needs.

If you plan to argue about speed then theres little line left, even spyders with a e-framew w/ xsf board w/ eyes has uncapped speeds, dragun can hit 20bps, so can zap, bkos, b2ks can hit 18+, 22+, nowadays i believe speed is more into how a person feels with a trigger/marker then the gun itself. There just too many guns at lower prices that can get more then enough speed to speed match vs higher ends (tho ya some,,, high ends are just mad speed)

I dunno, if i had my choice between tricking out my cocker to my hearts desire vs a stock timmy I would have stay with my pimped cocker, its just more fullfilling you might say to own your own 'custom upgraded' marker then some stock no matter what company or type. And anyways, if i had it, an E-blade is more then enough speed for me =]

Basically unless you have the $$ for a high end, a mid level gun is more then enough to put you as a serious tourny player. And Tricked mids can be actually cheaper if you keep shopping around for parts. I'm prob wrong in few if not many areas on what i said, feel free to attack those points

[MP11]

If you do get a mid level marker and upgrade it, it can compete with high end markers. Thing is, they will never be the same (performance wise), or better. This is because their are going to be a few parts on a gun that cannot be changed and those parts will effect performance, however if you do manage to upgrade those parts you will have spent a pretty penny on your marker. In that case you could of gotten a DM4, nice Intimitador, and what-not and would have had better resale.

-Mike

[Alpha]

I can't help but notice your making a ton of 'guides' lately. First of all, a ton of people seem to be doing this to try and get a sticky or rep... good that your writing it, but for the wrong reason. Not syaing that you are, beucase I'm not inside your head and I dont know what your htinking.

And secondly, there is a sticky whee all New User information should go.

[bobide]

bko is physically capped at like 17/18 bps. The noid can't break that bearer, period.

IMO, yes mid-ends can, but its just a tiny bit lower in performance, and in the end, not worth the dough. However, the satisfaction from it might make u want to go that way.... i don't know. I think just about every serious player is faced w/ this delmia.... and none of us know the right path dammit.

[hchammer]

I honestly believe that an Impulse is a good move to make. it is comparitively lower in price and will shoot ropes with very few modifications. I am sure that you have heard of the Nasty and the Strange Impulse. Those are strongly competitive guns. In the right persons hands, they are game winners.

[Angered Fists]

Originally Posted by Alpha

I can't help but notice your making a ton of 'guides' lately. First of all, a ton of people seem to be doing this to try and get a sticky or rep... good that your writing it, but for the wrong reason. Not syaing that you are, beucase I'm not inside your head and I dont know what your htinking.

And secondly, there is a sticky whee all New User information should go.

I was simply asking a question, the answer to which I am genuinely interested in knowing, in order to help myself make an informed decision when the times comes, (soon in my case, as indicated in my original post). I could have PMed someone and gotten the answer, however this way I can benefit from a wider variety of opinions as well as providing a documented thread in which the question and answers are stated for future members to consult when they are confronted with the same dilemma.

I am not naive enough to believe that the mods and admins of this forum are unable to tell when someone is whoring for recognition by posting what they think will earn them rep. I try and make informative posts, and yes I am hopeful that the reward will come, but that is not the intent of the post itself. The other 'guide' to which I am sure you are referring was posted because I have been discussing that particular concept in real life with friends who are newer to the sport than I am. I thought that it was likely that other people in the online community might also find that information useful. This 'guide' is hardly a guide hoping for rep, I didn't provide any useful information whatsoever, I am the one asking the question.

As for you Alpha, I have been detecting undertones of hostility in many of your posts directed at me. If I have done something to offend you, I must apologize. If you'd care to discuss it on aim, you know where to find me, but perhaps I'm being a bit too sensitive, when you find your emo-wrist slicer, mind lending it to me? (Not intended as a barbed comment, simply a joke in reference to your old signature).