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***D_Smalls*** · December 9th, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by olddfatbulldog

Don't trash on Americans wanting to keep their country closed when you have no idea what it actually is to live in a situation where we have nearly open borders.

You don't think our borders are open? You don't think we have our own border issues? We have something a lot worse then immigrants coming through our borders from the USA. I live in a border town, arguably the drug capital of southwestern ontario, rivaled only by mega-urban centers like the GTA, Greater Toronto Area, which is where the drugs that come through my city concentrate.

So, use some common sense before ya go on a american anglo-centric speal against me. (this last sentence isn't meant to be vindictive, more a recommendation of caution when you make an argument)

**toXic** · December 9th, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

You don't think we have our own border issues? We have something a lot worse then immigrants coming through our borders from the USA.

So, by using your logic, you are saying America doesnt have drugs coming through the border? Hmmm....

And, if it is coming through your border, where is it coming from? Hmmm, America? So that means a few things. First, America has just as much to worry about drugs being imported/exported than Canada. Plus, America must have it worse, since it is not only exporting drugs to Canada, but MAKING it also. Or importing it and Exporting it.

And we have all this immigration crap to deal with.

***D_Smalls*** · December 9th, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

You don't think we have our own border issues? We have something a lot worse then immigrants coming through our borders from the USA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by toXic

So, by using your logic, you are saying America doesnt have drugs coming through the border? Hmmm....

And, if it is coming through your border, where is it coming from? Hmmm, America? So that means a few things. First, America has just as much to worry about drugs being imported/exported than Canada. Plus, America must have it worse, since it is not only exporting drugs to Canada, but MAKING it also. Or importing it and Exporting it.

And we have all this immigration crap to deal with.

By using my logic? I made no logical deduction aside from stating that we have worse things than immigrants coming through our borders. No where do I make the conclusion or imply the conclusion that you don't have to deal with drug issues. No where did I even hint a comparison between our borders regarding the prevalence of drug traffic. So, your induction was inaccurate. By stating that we have worse things than immigrants coming through our borders, it does not entail that you do not have that issue. If it entails anything, it suggests that drugs are worse than immigrants and that people are focusing on the wrong problem, in both countries.

Your right, America does have issues with drugs and it's affecting the country I live in. But I'm not sure why you're arguing whether or not America has it worse than Canada.

You're missing the point.

I'm address guy's point that he feels we Canadians do not understand what it's like to have open borders and to have problems arising from our borders.

**toXic** · December 9th, 11:06 PM

Either I missed a few words the first time or your edit was good... lol.

What you said there, makes it look like only Canada has drug issues with it being exported/imported. Whether that can be "entailed" as this or that doesn't matter.

Have you ever thought that doing these things to stop illegal immigration will also help stop the importation/exportation of drugs?

You know what, never mind about everything I said. Right now my brain is so scattered I feel like a retard trying to hump a door knob.

***D_Smalls*** · December 9th, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toXic

Either I missed a few words the first time or your edit was good... lol.

What you said there, makes it look like only Canada has drug issues with it being exported/imported. Whether that can be "entailed" as this or that doesn't matter.

Have you ever thought that doing these things to stop illegal immigration will also help stop the importation/exportation of drugs?

haha no the only editing was to add that last sentence to make sure that he didn't think i was meaning offense.

When I went back and read what I said, I can see how intuitively one might conclude that I was implying that our issue is worse. you kind of get that 'you worry about that, but we worry about this that is worse' feeling from it. So I recognize now where you got that impression, but I think that intuitive conclusion doesn't do the logistics of the language justice. But it's unavoidable, the intuition part, so I'll keep those kind of impressions in mind next time.

I think cutting back on illegal immigration in the States would cut back on the importation of drugs into the USA, but not the exportation into Canada. This may seem like a stupid conclusion, and it could be, but the kinds of drugs im concerned with are designer drugs, a drug which I think the typical illegal immigrant has very little involvement with. Likewise, I think cutting back on illegal immigration in the states would cut back on drugs like marijuana but probably not X or cocaine.

However, if America's views on immigrants wasn't so demeaning then perhaps immigrants would not be forced to result to trafficking and a life of crime to sustain themselves.

***D_Smalls*** · December 9th, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toXic

You know what, never mind about everything I said. Right now my brain is so scattered I feel like a retard trying to hump a door knob.

Agreed, my head's killing me. Been studying for Stats all day. Bleh.

**toXic** · December 9th, 11:26 PM

Off topic time.

Last week my stats professor gave us a test on our last day in class and we had a course evaluation to do. Well, she started to hand out the test, then took it up. She replied, "I better give you the Course Evaluation before the test." Nobody thought much about it, the class had been pretty good and the majority were making good grades. So her evaluations will be good.

After the test, there were a several that left there cussing at her. It was absolutely horrible, im expecting an 80 at best.

But back on topic, meth is starting to be about the only thing around here. You still have your weed smokers, but cocaine and everything else is about gone. And you cant stop letting Americans in to Canada.... Where would our future presidents go when they re-establish the draft?

**mspainter** · December 9th, 11:29 PM

I'm not really against the draft. I don't know why but I'm down for it.

**ComradeMolyneux** · December 9th, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddhaHybrid

If we have open borders, mah ganj should be a bit cheaper...

I dun know, you have to allocate a percentage of the cost to the risk of dealing it. It's not like it's super legal like tobacco or anything.

Besides, I'm positive that Northern Cali has some of the finest weed on the planet. But I wouldn't know, I don't dabble in the stuff.

***D_Smalls*** · December 9th, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComradeMolyneux

Besides, I'm positive that Northern Cali has some of the finest weed on the planet.

Yeah, cuz it comes from BC.

Wait, what... no i didnt say that.

**ComradeMolyneux** · December 9th, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toXic

Off topic time.

Last week my stats professor gave us a test on our last day in class and we had a course evaluation to do. Well, she started to hand out the test, then took it up. She replied, "I better give you the Course Evaluation before the test." Nobody thought much about it, the class had been pretty good and the majority were making good grades. So her evaluations will be good.

After the test, there were a several that left there cussing at her. It was absolutely horrible, im expecting an 80 at best.

But back on topic, meth is starting to be about the only thing around here. You still have your weed smokers, but cocaine and everything else is about gone. And you cant stop letting Americans in to Canada.... Where would our future presidents go when they re-establish the draft?

Rolling Stone had an issue about the drug war, but then again, Rolling Stone mag is just a bunch of Hyped up pussy liberal bull****.

**buddhaHybrid** · December 10th, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

Yeah, cuz it comes from BC.

Wait, what... no i didnt say that.

Sorry, but BC-Bud is hardly considered le creme de la creme.

However, those Canucks make a lot more than just a home brew!...Even so I'm sure BCB is better closer to its home, but still.

...I mean, So I've heard from various derelicts...

**olddfatbulldog** · December 10th, 11:06 PM

Ok Smalls, you're really assuming I'm a lot stupider then I am.

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

You don't think our borders are open? You don't think we have our own border issues? We have something a lot worse then immigrants coming through our borders from the USA. I live in a border town, arguably the drug capital of southwestern ontario, rivaled only by mega-urban centers like the GTA, Greater Toronto Area, which is where the drugs that come through my city concentrate.

I never said I thought your borders weren't open. In fact, I would have stayed out of this argument but I just read an article in The Economist about Canada's illegal immigration (or more about it's naturalization process) so I thought it would be a little more fair to say something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

So, use some common sense before ya go on a american anglo-centric speal against me. (this last sentence isn't meant to be vindictive, more a recommendation of caution when you make an argument)

You're right, I was totally thinking irrationally because of my white supremacist view of the lowly "brown people". More on that at the bottom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_Smalls

contraction.

I "don't live in it", therefore I "have no idea what things are like". Yet, you don't live in Canada so why can I not "try and tell [you] Canadan is even close to similar"? By saying I can't I'm getting the feeling that you know it to be worse in USA, but "you don't live in [Canada]" so how can you possibly hold that assumption to be true, based on your previous logic anyways.

But, you're right though; Canada doesn't have illegal immigrants.

So if you'll excuse my Euro-Centric mindset, I'd like to explain my situation to you. And don't just try and say Canada has illegal immigrants and that's that. Canada's illegal immigration is "problem" is NOTHING compared to ours. I live in a border town as well, except border towns in California extend for hundreds of miles upwards of the border. I live in Pomona. 50 years ago it was an up and coming city with a lot of zeal. It was even mentioned on an episode of I Love Lucy because of it's beauty and general class. And now about 70% of the city I live in is hispanic, most of whom are illegal immigrants. This is one of the highest illegal immigrant concentrations in the nation. And coincidentally, Pomona has job availability from a university, to a medical center, as well as other outlets for labour. But for some reason, we have the #3 murder rate in California and one of the worst gang and drug problems in the nation as well. These problems did not exist before the influx of illegal immigration. I can't drive in downtown because there is a chance I could be shot because I am white and may drive through the wrong part of town. (I'm not exaggerating).

That's my sitaution, what's yours smalls? I know you feel immigration, but don't make the assumption that you have anything close to similar experiences then I do. And maybe you didn't assume that, but you assumed way too much about me and what I believe.

I respect hard working, legal immigrants. People that are willing to follow the law to get into a country, general follow it once they get in (my mom for example).

*Finally, note I say Euro-Centric, because I am not an Anglo as you suggested earlier. Nor do I feel influenced by them. Although I'll concede that reading The Economist may give me a more Anglo-Centric mindset.

Sorry if this is a jumbled mess.

**sNoW PIrAnHa** · December 11th, 08:29 PM

Adam-
Pomona: Uniform Crime Reports of Pomona Police and Index from 1985 to 2005 21/156,480 is 0.000134
Compton: Uniform Crime Reports of Compton Police and Index from 1985 to 2005 65/96,874 is 0.000671
Richmond: Uniform Crime Reports of Richmond Polic and Index from 1985 to 2005 40/103,100 is 0.000388
Oakland: Uniform Crime Reports of Oakland Police and Index from 1985 to 2005 93/400,519 is 0.000232

It looks like you're a little off, unless you have another source.

**toXic** · December 11th, 08:35 PM

In 1999 Pomona ranked third for the highest murder rate in California behind Compton, California and Richmond, California. Nationally, the murder rate ranked 25th in the nation. By 2006, however, Pomona has reduced its crime rate from this high. - Wiki

http://www.morganquitno.com/cit99rank.pdf shows pomona ranked 25 in nation.

**olddfatbulldog** · December 11th, 10:43 PM

You'll have to forgive me for that.

**DuoDSG** · December 11th, 11:25 PM

Going back to the original analogy-

Sure, it's a stretch, since none of us own the entire country, and just about all of us live in the US so we can't say it's any better/worse than other countries out of personal experience. Granted, I don't really believe a whole lot that I hear on the news, but having worked among spanish-speaking illegals for the last two years in the Bay Area (just a tiny microcosm, mind you, I know that) the problem is pretty severe and it's about time something gets done either way on a national level.

Don't get me wrong- I love the people I met and served, and they are good people (the vast majority, at least), but I came to the conclusion that there are two types of people that come illegally to this country from Latin and South America (that they are all from Mexico is an extreme exaggeration):

1. Good people trying to support their families back home by working here for an undefined period (usually a few years), which live in garages/closets/etc for the entirety of their stay here in the US; they send most of their earnings back home to their families.

Most of the people in this category are single men (husbands).

2. Good people who come here and try to work towards residency and citizenship, and as such, even though they came here illegally they are doing SOMETHING to progress up the social and economic ladder. This type of people come to stay and, if single husbands, eventually obtain the funds to bring their families here with them. They make an effort to learn English and get better jobs.

Both types are illegal, so both are breaking the law, but I only support the latter in my country. Sure, the illegals are paying sales tax but that doesn't make up for paying into social services and other taxes by being a documented worker. The first kind I can't stand, simply because they come here to submit themselves to a lower standard of work and living (usually get paid less than minimum wage for menial jobs, which sadly enough is usually better than what they get in their home country) and they leech off the economy and then leave. The second kind I love, because these people are looking to integrate themselves into America and become an involved citizen that doesn't live in complacency, stuck in the same rut all his life.

You can call me racist, discrimnatory, etc but I'm not, period. I just believe that if you want to liv