Gimmick

Ok, I'm guessing just from what I've found on the internet so far, that this thread is going to stirr up a little trouble as so many people have different opinions about sniping and hiding in trees. But, please try not to argue, that is not my intent for this thread.


Ok, here is my question. Besides the obvious concerns when climbing trees, and shooting from them, do I need to worrie about my FPS?

I've been playing with my friends for a while, and just recently, the owner of the property (who plays with us) has said "no more climbing trees". I've only done it 3 times, out of the 4 weekends we've played. And I've done well everytime...(nobody found me, and I shot at least 2 people). Anyway, his reasoning for this decision is that he has been told that shooting down like that can increase your velosity *pardon my spelling* by as much as 80 FPS. And he said that it could be enough to break a mask.

We all set our guns for 280 FPS with a full tank at our local field, so the max he is saying my gun could get is 360 FPS.

Now, I've already checked the physics of it http://www.physicsforums.com/showthr...94#post1100294 and that isn't a problem. Everyone said it would slow down after being fired. But that is assuming it is being fired at 280 FPS.

The only thing I'm not sure of is, will my gun fire different when pointed down? I.E. Liquid CO2 flows into the gun and shoots harder. I've been told by the owner of our local field that if you do shoot while pointing down, if anything, it will slow down...and use up a bunch of CO2. Something about the liquid not having enough time to turn into gas.

So, is there any valitity to my friend's worries? I have a Custom 98 and I use an extention tube for the CO2 if that makes a difference.

P.S. I have a professional climbing harnest, and I ALWAYS secure myself before playing, so I don't have to worrie about falling. Like I said, I've done well in the trees, but I havn't been found by any of them yet. I may loose my enthusiasm for trees after they find me though.

- Gimmick

DarkTamer

Well, ignoring air friction it would indeed speed up considerably, obviously because of gravity, and because horizantal velocity doesn't change for projectiles. Since this is reality, and there's air friction, my guess is without any doing any sort of math at all that instead of just slowing like a paintball does normally when shot from the ground, it would maintain it's velocity, or at decelerate slower. Being up in a tree wouldn't actually make it go above 280fps or w/e the FPS limit is.

However, having a gun with co2 on it pointed downwards will indeed make your gun shoot faster, your field owner is wrong. I don't know the exact science behind it, but it's known for years. It was a common form of cheating back in the day to just tilt your gun down for a while, and then your first shot would be a ton faster, I've heard rumors of up to 400FPS in some cases, but again those are just rumors.


Besides, like you yourself suggested, it won't be very fun when you finally are found stuck in a tree with no where to go and nothing to hide behind


If you really want to continue and convince the property owner to go along with it, the simple solution would be to upgrade to HPA. Using an anti-siphon tank might work too, although by the sound of it you already have a remote line (extension tube...?), which basically serves the same purpose... unless for some reason the co2 tank is still tilted upside down and at a higher elevation than the gun. Either way I still suggest upgrading to HPA, no velocity fluctuations at all, regardless of the orientation of your setup, or even weather changes.

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Gimmick

HPA? is that an expantion chamber?

paintballin34

Here's the deal. Your gun is probably already shooting the paintball faster than gravity could accelerate the ball. Paintballs have very low mass. I suspect that terminal velocity. The speed that gravity can accelerate it to is much lower than what your gun is shooting. IE:300fps. Sounds like you are very safe in trees. Harness and all even. Can't even see a safety issue with this. Besides you being trapped up there. LOL. Can imagine someone with a lot of paint catching you up there. : )

Torch

Tilting the marker downwards (And the CO2 tank being valve down) could raise the velocity a good deal.

The tank contains both liquid and gas CO2. Think of it as a un-opened soda bottle. Gas at the top, liquid at the bottom. Your marker is normally using the gas and everything is fine. The gas is high pressure, when you shoot it propels the ball down the barrel.

If you take in liquid or a mix of liquid and gas, the liquid will start to turn into a gas when you shoot. This added gas will raise your velocity. The first shot pointing down may not be all that much higher. But if you keep going the gun will start to suck in more liquid and the velocity will climb.



An anti-siphon tube goes inside the tank and basically moves the intake from the back of the valve, to the top middle of the tank. This helps take in only gas when the tank is level with the ground.

Now HPA isn't an expansion chamber.

HPA is high-pressure air. Compressed air. It's also called nitro or nitrogen sometimes.
It is always a gas, has no liquid state that anyone could hope to reach with paintball equipment, and is Not effected by temperature or the way the tank is pointed.

I'd say the other option would be to use a remote system and have the tank on your back of leg. That should keep the valve facing upwards and help boil off any liquid that does make it out of the tank.

Or stay out of the trees. =)

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mglax13

Using some basic physics, I calculated the acceleration of gravity to be about 32fpss. If you shoot a paintball strait down from a 10ft height at a velocity of 280 fps, when the paintball hits the ground, it will be traveling at just over 281fps, thus posing absolutly no danger what so ever. This is in ideal conditions with no wind resistance, so you can imagine that the ball would be going even slower, as stated above.

If CO2 caused your velocity to spike by using the liquid to shoot, then lets say for arguments sake that it boosted the velocity up to 320fps. That shot, strait down from a 10 ft height would hit the ground at a speed of 321fps, still not a giant risk.

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Mangobutter

no hpa, high pressure air, its compressed air, and better than co2

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M4Maniac

Tell the field owner to look at this thread, or do the equation on paper and show him that the ball wouldn't accelerate past mask-breaking level.

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Zues

Hell I doubt you could even get a paintball fast enough to break a lense without it desintegrating (sp?) in flight. Masks are tested with steel ball bearings shot out of things much more powerful than a paintball gun. I doubt I can find it but there was a thread about how a guy wanted to see just how strong a mask was, so he shot it with bird shot pointblank with his shotgun like 6 times, and the lense was still intact..

Lenses are VERY strong, much to strong to be broken with a paintball gun..

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demonpoptart

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Decker9

/\ I don't know about your local shop, but even mediocre steelys at my store are $120+....

And I'm not sure shooting from a tree is even safe for you...one minor malfunction could cause enough kick to fall out...I don't really get why you would want to either, but, oh well.

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demonpoptart

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Gimmick

Whew! Prices are just a bit high. Almost more that the gun itself. I'll be checking with the owerner soon about wether he'll let me play with the remote line and tank on my leg.

I'm guessing he just talked to someone who said it's possible to get higher FPS if shooting down, and that scared him away from the idea. Besides playing at my friend's place, my brothers and I have been playing behind our house for a while, and I nor they have NEVER noticed any increase in speed or anything like that when fireing from trees.

Thanks for all the input guys. Like I said, I'll drop back in, and let you know how it goes!

Thanks - Gimmick